Alfie Kirkpatrick [Developer] I tested that now and seems perfect to me. Thank you very much .. I think it can go on main server .. is brilliant !

LATER EDIT: Ah, I am not sure it is perfect .. I just checked the final standings of the tournament and I appear in 5th place even though I played the 3rd place playoff against myself. That can't be alright I think. :-(

Alfie Kirkpatrick [Developer] wouldn't be a good solution to treat a double entry as two separate nicknames ?

For example, when I am joining a tournament using two entries, then in Standings tab my name should appear twice ("Denis George #1" and "Denis George #2") and in the Matches tab my name should appear as Denis George but under it, my nickname should appear correspondingly as "playhunter#1" and "playhunter#2" so the system can treat my two entries as two separate players.

Because if you will implement it this way, I think we can also run Swiss tournaments which can allow double buy-ins.

PS: Also, as it is now, if a player uses double buy in and also opted for Side Poll, he should pay the Side Poll feature twice because he can't opt in to use the Side Poll feature for only one of his two entries. I think that if you tweak the system to treat double entries from the same person as two separate nicknames, then that person will also be allowed to opt in for using Side Poll only on one of his two entries, and the TD will be able to mark which one of his two entries is in for Side Poll bet too.

Denis-George Constantin (playhunter) just saw your extra comment. The data on beta was reset since unfortunately. Do you think you could recreate the issue (on beta, would be helpful). Thanks

Denis-George Constantin (playhunter), I think it would be straightforward to visually add '#1' and '#2' to player names and usernames, but to actually have them as two fully different players would be tricky. The username is really deep in all of the data. For example, if we made a different "virtual" username#2, the player would not see these matches in their match history, etc, etc.

I think allowing double entry in a Swiss would also require more different functionality. It's very likely the player would meet themselves in the early rounds (as opposed to elimination where it can only happen in the final/runner up match). So it might be desirable to block the player from meeting themselves even if next to each other in the table at the end of a round. Is double entry Swiss really something people would like?! Am having trouble getting my head around it.

Alfie Kirkpatrick [Developer] I kind of reproduced it. This time it appears that I finished the tournament in 2nd place when in fact the final was played between Valentine and Patroclus while I only played against myself for the 3rd place playoff.

Three years ago I played 8 Swiss tournaments with two lives, where each player could join with a double entry if they wish (paying the entry twice). We were about 20-25 people and 6-8 of them (including myself) were using the double entry. In rounds 2-4 I meet myself 3 times, and similar situation happened to some other players too, but nobody was really unhappy about it. We would have liked to continue these tournaments but the organizer decided to stop them.

It is true that ideally would be to prevent matching a player against himself at least for the first few early rounds when possible, but if that's too much effort, for sure is not needed. As for the first round, it can be avoided because the TD can manually redraw the start immediately until such occurrence is not happening.

Denis-George Constantin (playhunter) apologies I blew away the data again by accident!

I created another tournament like yours and fixed the standings issue. The standings "played" and "wins" column are now using same values - that is, the number of "best of" match-ups played/won, rather than number of matches, so hopefully the win ratio is now always correct and will show correct order.

I thought some more about the virtual player idea. It's requires too much change at lots of levels and will likely lead to bugs!

I could probably support a Swiss where the system avoids pairing up a player with themselves unless absolutely necessary. It might lead to some strange draws for some rounds though. We would need to decide whether it's better for two players to play each other again or if we should give a bye to a double-entry player. I don't like the idea that double entry is a way to purchase additional buys!

Anyway, if you're happy with how beta is working I will promote to live.

Denis-George Constantin (playhunter) this is promoted to live now - any issues let me know.

Alfie Kirkpatrick [Developer] sorry for my slow reply, I was pretty busy and only now I was able to test it again. Unfortunately something seems still wrong with the standings, here Ludovic played the final vs Petruchio while I played the 3rd place playoff, but Petruchio appears in 4th place in standings list while in 2nd place appears Philemon which was eliminated in the 2nd round (after receiving a bye in the 1st round).

For double entry in a Swiss format, I think if you will set the system to avoid a player being matched against himself unless absolutely necessary, then would be fair to limit the double entry players to receiving only one bye during the rounds, and the second bye can be received only after everyone remaining alive in the tournament got at least one bye. Yes for sure there will be rounds where the pairings will be repeated much more frequently in order to avoid pairing a double entry player against himself and I personally find that aspect acceptable.

Denis-George Constantin (playhunter) unfortunately I managed to delete the data on beta again - arghh! I have some tests that run which delete all the data and ran one accidentally.

However, I spotted the bug in the code and I'm pretty sure it is fixed (on beta and live).

Alfie Kirkpatrick [Developer] something is still not good, take a look here: I won 3rd place playoff vs George Urswick while Petruchio lost the grand final against Francis Grey but the final standings show me in 2nd place while Petruchio appears in 3rd.

Denis-George Constantin (playhunter) Oh my word, I'm sorry for all the work you've had to do to finding the bugs! I promise not to delete the tournament this time. Think I'm going to have to logically split entries as you suggested previosuly, but it's not clear to me yet the best way to code it.

Have you ever considered a career in software testing?!

I've pushed a fix to beta and live. It was a subtle bug. I already had some code to deal with 3rd place playoff in a straight elimination, as this player has the same win rate as the 2nd placed player. However the code was looking at the first match played which in the best-of N format can be a win or lose.

Anyway, I hope it's fixed now. I did try in the process to split the players who are double entry - it's possible just about but was getting v messy.